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I ride an old airhead R80RT - not much in common with what you're considering. Two observations: Of all the Japanese bikes I've owned, this - my first BMW - handles better than any other bike I've ridden. Secondly, it certainly costs more to buy oil filters and various parts for a BMW than for a Jap bike. In some ways, the BMW experience is very similar to the Harley experience: there's a noticeable percentage of brand snobs and it costs money to own the brand.
 
Are they prone to certain mechanical problems? Final drive issue rumors abound. Key anntena rings were replaced under warranty, and the occasional fuel pump/controller failure are all I'm aware of.

- What's the truth about maintenance? (frequency, cost, difficulty, etc.) Maintenance is easy on the 2007 and up models. Pre-2007 had wizzy brakes (Servo assist that is harder to service but still do-able. You can do it all yourself (valves, brake fluid, gear box, final drive etc.) for about $50

- Any final drive problems? They exist in an estimated 4% of R series bikes. GS appear to be overrepresented in this figure.

- Are they as nice to travel on as they look? Yes, especially with an aftermarket seat. Mine is a Rick Mayer saddle.

- How do they compare to the V-Strom? More power, quicker acceleration, better gas mileage, longer range, better weather protection, heated grips, seats, cruise control, computer, AM/FM/CD, and list goes on.

- What's it like to travel long-distance on these bikes? (I regularly ride b/t 500 and 800 miles in one day when I travel? I think I just answered that one.

- Do you have to be rich to own one? I bought my 2005 with 17K miles, every option and accessory for ~$10,000. Insurance is about $400/year and I do my own maintenance.
 
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I ride an '05 GS, so it's similar in many ways.


- Are they prone to certain mechanical problems?

Only if you ask the people who don't own one.

- What's the truth about maintenance? (frequency, cost, difficulty, etc.)

Valves and oil every 6k. You can do it yourself in about an hour. Every 12k you're also supposed to do tranny fluid, FD fluid, and brakes. They're all easy too. Oil filters are around $20 and fluid choice is up to you.

- Any final drive problems?

Everyone knows someone who knows someone who had a failure, but in reality they're pretty rare

- Are they as nice to travel on as they look?

From what I hear

- What's it like to travel long-distance on these bikes? (I regularly ride b/t 500 and 800 miles in one day when I travel)

I can easily do 600-700 mile days on the GS without any issue and I hear the RT is much more comfortable

- Do you have to be rich to own one?
- I'm still under 40 and solidly middle class. Will this disqualify me? Is there some law that says I can't have one?:rofl:

No, I'm still under 30 and solidly poor, and not because I own a BMW so you can save your jokes peanut gallery. :giveup:
 
Texagator said:

Somebody please tell me about the R1200RT. I know all the info that you can read on the BMW website but I'm looking for some advice based on real-world experience.
- Are they prone to certain mechanical problems?
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yeah sorta...I have an 05 with 43,000 miles..Left me stranded with a fuel line quick disconnect failure which is probably the most common failure.


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What's the truth about maintenance? (frequency, cost, difficulty, etc.)
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They are high maintenance but I've learned to do most of it myself..The newer models are easier because they do not have the servo assist brakes. Manual calls for valve adjustment every 6000 mi. but once they are broken in they don't need it that often. Service is expensive if performed by dealer..like $400.00 - $500.00 for a service requiring brake bleed which is every two years..


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Any final drive problems?
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a fair number

Are they as nice to travel on as they look?
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absolutely!

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How do they compare to the V-Strom?
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never ridden one


- What's it like to travel long-distance on these bikes? (I regularly ride b/t 500 and 800 miles in one day when I travel)
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best bike I've ever had by far

Do you have to be rich to own one?
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only if you buy new and depend on your dealer for service..
We have group get togethers to do maintenance and there are c.d.'s available that make it easy to learn to do your own service..

They are not the most reliable bike but once you own one and learn to work on it you will have a great appreciation for it if you want a sport tourer with the emphasis on touring..There is something about the boxer that I love..And the cruise control will spoil you forever..
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I'd say it requires slightly more maintenance if you keep up with the recommended intervals. Personally, since my bike is out of warranty, I'll change the oil every 6,000 miles, the gear box and final drive lube every 18,000. Brake fluid evey year or two valves probably every other oil change. I have a code reader so I don't even have to pay for that step. I've always felt that BMW's intervals were excessive. They make up for lower sales volume with service IMHO.
 
Texagator said:
Thanks for all the replies.

Is it fair to say that once a guy has gotten his hands on one of these bikes, it's no more difficult to keep up and service than any other make/model?
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IMO no. It's super easy to keep up and service. You can easily do it all yourself. I'm not a mechanic. I'm not even technically inclined. But the R series is a very easy bike to work on. And you can do it yourself for free, which teaches you more about your bike should you have a problem abroad.

Do it. Do it.
 
Kit_McConnico said:
IMO no. It's super easy to keep up and service. You can easily do it all yourself. I'm not a mechanic. I'm not even technically inclined. But the R series is a very easy bike to work on. And you can do it yourself for free, which teaches you more about your bike should you have a problem abroad.

Do it. Do it.
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+1 (you meant "IMO yes" based on Gator's wording). It's easy to get at it everything (at least on a GS; the RT does have more tupperware but I wouldn't imagine it's that hard to remove). Lots of resources, too, like Jim Von Baden's DVD. It lays out all the maintenance procedures in a form understandable to even someone of my skill (for point of reference, I've recently learned that you should use the pointy end of the screwdriver on the screw)
 
Yes you're right. What I mean is it's easy as crap to do the maintenance.
 
People gripe about servo brakes, and they are expensive to replace should you need to (I haven't). But man they flat STOP. I think they discontinued them in 2006, but maybe someone else could chime in on that.

CANBUS is just like the final drive. Everyone gripes about it, no one actually had a first hand problem with it. I run Gerbings jacket liner and a GPS with it. I run a iphone charger off the powerlet plug below the seat. Baaaah. Nothing wrong with CANBUS. And I don't have a fuse box or any of that jazz.
 
Kit and others may know more about this than me, but I know the R1200 series bikes with the servo-assist ABS brakes (2005-2007?) are very expensive to fix. The newer models ditched the servos (I think the new system is called ABS II). I guess it would depend on what year model you're looking at.

As for canbus, you'll have to get a fuse block (centech is most popular, but there are others). In stock form, I couldn't draw much off the powerlet plug (ex: air pump). The fuse blocks are around $55.
 
Sully said:
Kit and others may know more about this than me, but I know the R1200 series bikes with the servo-assist ABS brakes (2005-2007?) are very expensive to fix. The newer models ditched the servos (I think the new system is called ABS II). I guess it would depend on what year model you're looking at.

As for canbus, you'll have to get a fuse block (centech is most popular, but there are others). In stock form, I couldn't draw much off the powerlet plug (ex: air pump). The fuse blocks are around $55.
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Did your brakes crap out?

Also I didn't know you had problems with the powerlet. Mine was fine (and we were using the same charger.)
 
No, brakes are functioning fine, and they do stop the bike NOW. I do wish though that I had the non-servo brakes, for simplicity. As for can-bus, I've had zero reliability issues with it, I just needed to add the fuses to be able to use the accessories I had (Now that I said that about the phone, I can't recall if I did test it pre-block, but the pump definitely wouldn't run). Do you know if the early Hex RTs had the same main seal as the GSs? We might ought to mention that too if he's looking at one of those years.
 
Sully said:
No, brakes are functioning fine, and they do stop the bike NOW. I do wish though that I had the non-servo brakes, for simplicity. As for can-bus, I've had zero reliability issues with it, I just needed to add the fuses to be able to use the accessories I had (phone charger, air pump). Do you know if the early Hex RTs had the same main seal as the GSs? We might ought to mention that too if he's looking at one of those years.
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hmmh. I didn't know you had issues with the phone charger or air pump. My bike powers them just fine.

Something of note that you did mention though. Some of the earlier 1200's (and lots of other modern BMWs) have issues with a rear main seal leak between the engine and transmission. This will eventually contaminate your clutch. Usually when it happens people replace the rear main seal and transmission input shaft seal. It cost me $1900 and I would gladly pay it again. I'm that sold on the GS. Supposedly the newer "brown" seals don't fail the same way.
 
Hey, I was in Ouray, Co from Aug 14-22nd! My wife and I used this as a base for riding out of. Stayed in B&B. Charcoal gray RT. My wife wore a white helmet with black poka-dots on it - hard to miss!

Anyway, I had a VStrom DL1000 and an 05 R1200RT at the same time. I sold the Suzuki and still have the RT. VStrom more out of the hole torque. On the road in 6th, the RT pulls away. Gas milage... RT wins. Range... RT wins. Comfort... RT wins. The VStrom was nice, just a different bike.

05 RT is not high maintenance. You don't oil or maintain chains, no oiling or cleaning cables - all hydraulic. They do not require value adjustments every 6k. I believe the manual says 6k then every 10k. However, after 10,000+ miles, my values adjustment did not change a bit. I change oil every 5K, changed my final drive oil at 15K. Nothing hard about any of it. More expensive oil or filters? NO. Buy my filters from A&S when on sale. Less than $10 each. Get several at one time. Parts more expensive? Not any more so than any of my other bikes.

Bike is rock solid, comfy w/o the weight and handles great. Not expensive to keep up. Cost about same as taking a bike to any dealer. Weight? About the same as the VStrom. I believe 545 wet?

I know lots of people with Beemers now that I have one. Don't know of a single one that had a problem but me. Had a horn switch go bad and the horn would not quit. Had to disconnect. BMW warrantied the entire switch assembly. Had a headlight fastener break. Repaired it myself.

Also installed speakers and an amplifier so I could play my MP3 or ipod. Better than radio! It does not fade!
 
Texagator said:
Quick background on my current bike situation:

- Are they prone to certain mechanical problems?
- What's the truth about maintenance? (frequency, cost, difficulty, etc.)
- Any final drive problems?
- Are they as nice to travel on as they look?
- How do they compare to the V-Strom?
- What's it like to travel long-distance on these bikes? (I regularly ride b/t 500 and 800 miles in one day when I travel)
- Do you have to be rich to own one?
- I'm still under 40 and solidly middle class. Will this disqualify me? Is there some law that says I can't have one?:rofl:
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Mechanical Problems - Final drives - This can be eliminated or heavily reduced by proper preventative maintenance. BMW has even changed the design of their swingarm in recent models to allow for easier oil changes on the swingarm. Contrary to what the salesman says they are not limited to the GS's...LT's get just as many. The RT is not a big one for it though.

Maintenance - Truth, not bad to maintain yourself...get handy with a wrench and they are cheap to maintain, go to the dealer...you had better bring vasolene with you.

Are they nice to travel on? - In my opinion yes. They are comfortable over long periods of travel, eat miles and do it in style. Secondly, when you hit some twisties they really do handle well.

Vstrom/RT comparison - Different strokes for different folks. The strom is a good bike, but in my opinion (again with this) the RT is a better long range touring bike.

Whats it like to travel long distance on an RT - It is great, thats what they are made for.

Do you have to be rich to own one? - No, but like anything else it helps.

Under 40 - Not a disqualifer. RT's dont care how old you are, they are just a machine.

Take one for a test ride, pop your spouse/significant other/life partner on the back of it and go. See if you can finagle 3+ hours of riding on it and just go for a trip on it. You will enjoy it, your s/so/lp will enjoy it...and then both of you sit down and try to figure out how to buy one from there.

Remember though, dont trust your salesman...they are all thieves, doesnt matter where they work they are not there to do you favors but to make the dealership money. Dont be afraid to price RT's out of state, BMW of OK city is regularly less on their ad's than BMW of north dallas (Plano) etc. And if you look around in other areas of the country they are even cheaper than that. Fly and rides can be a hoot, what better way to christen your new RT than a 1200 mile homeward trip, oil change at the end of it.
 
I've never ridden a R12RT, but like you, I've drooled over a bunch of them.

I did have a '03 ST1300 and was quite pleased with it. At the time I was comparing the new ST to the new RT and there was a huge price difference. Now, Honda has raised their prices to be almost exactly the same as that of the RT.

So if I were buying new, I would probably get the RT.
Buying used, I'd have to look around and see what the prices were.

Good luck on your search! :thumb:
 
Texagator said:
I'm not trying to start a flamefest here but I am tempted to reconsider the ST1300 with ceramic-coated headers, a cruise control, and a better seat. Even with these add-ons, the total cost wouldn't come close to that of the RT.
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Better check the price again. Last I looked the base model for both bikes was within a few hundred dollars of each other and the RT was less! Last year Honda figured they could entice riders to open up the wallets by raising the price of the ST, which I thought was stupid. But, I'm guessing they were simply passing on higher costs to the consumer. Now, depending on sales, you might find a deal on the Honda if a dealer hasn't moved inventory in a while, but feature for feature, dollar for dollar, I'm going bet the BMW will win (and yes, I'm a bit biased having owned two RTs).

Wayne
 
Don't be scared off by a bike with servo assist brakes. I have them on my 1100S Boxercup and they stop great and also perform well on the track. If you have a bit of mechical skill you can service them yourself as I learned to do it on mine.

Because the servo assist actually separates the fluid in the controls from the fluid going to the calipers you have to bleed both circuits. On my 1100 I removed tank plastic, removed tank bolts, rotated tank off to the side without disconnecting anything. With tank off to the side servo module is exposed. I bought two new reservoir caps and added a nipple to them to connect to clear tubing and a funnel. activated the brakes and the servo motor pumped the new fluid through. Turned out easier than I thought plus you don't have to do it that often.
 
wbrisett said:
Better check the price again. Last I looked the base model for both bikes was within a few hundred dollars of each other and the RT was less! Last year Honda figured they could entice riders to open up the wallets by raising the price of the ST, which I thought was stupid. But, I'm guessing they were simply passing on higher costs to the consumer. Now, depending on sales, you might find a deal on the Honda if a dealer hasn't moved inventory in a while, but feature for feature, dollar for dollar, I'm going bet the BMW will win (and yes, I'm a bit biased having owned two RTs).

Wayne
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I too have noticed this similarity in prices. Base on ST1300 seems to be $16,000 and base on the RT $16,800, but has more options.

Guess now we can say "Honda just sells overpriced bikes!"
 
I've got one of the first 1200gs's that came into austin, bought it a bit over 5 years ago. I had already put a 100k on airheads and wasn't impressed with the oilheads (first airhead successor) but the r12 has brought me back in.

Servo brakes, wasn't impressed at first until I really started hammering them in the curves. No fading and not hard to service. Final drive issues seem overblown to me, there must be 500k units out there now and how many failures? I've never changed the FD fluid in any of my bmws and none have failed due of it.

I did have the input shaft splines strip at 52k miles, covered under extended warranty. Had a lot of rattling for years i thought was the the throwout bearing. Have not seen many similar failures so chalk it up to poor assembly or
soft metal in the input shaft.

Even with that, it's still the most reliable bike i've owned and with 75k has never failed to start. I have the same spark plugs in it I installed at 18k miles.

One thing I do recommend is ditching the plastic fuel lines QD in favor of metal. The plastic ones are brittle and will leave you stranded or soaked in gas. I went though 2 before upgrading.
 
Texagator said:
The salesman was nice and informative without being too pushy. (BTW:He assured me that the final drive was solid and that the real story on BMW final drive failures was that most of them occurred on GS bikes. He said that people were not performing adequate maintenance on their GS final drives, especially after riding them off-road, and that dirt and grime destroyed the rubber seal which allowed the oil to all drain out.)
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BULL!!! BMW first said that the final drive was filled for life at the factory and there was no drain plug provided. There were final drive failures. BMW then said the final drive oil should be changed at the 600 mile check and then was good for life. There were final drive failures. BMW then provided a way to drain and fill the final drive and said the oil should be changed every 12k miles. There were final drive failures. The latest thoughts are the failures come from pressure building in the final drive and the seal failing from the pressure, then the oil is lost, then the drive fails. The latest spec from BMW has reduced the quantity of oil in the hexhead (R1200) final drive. Maybe this is the answer. The final drive failures do seem to be from loss of oil, NOT from the large bearing self-destructing as in the K1200LT's (mostly).
Ride Safe,
Phil Marvin - El Paso, TX
 
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