So many choices...

So I have pretty much decided that I want the Nikon AF-S 18-200mm VR lens, but... I'd also like to have the 50mm/f1.8 to go with it. No kits that I can find combine the two. But here is what I have been able to find.

• D5100 with 18-200

Pretty much all the kits I can find for the D7000 run about $1500 give or take a few bucks. The only issue is what comes in the kits.

• D7000 18-55/55-200/55 off body flash
  
  
  This one does not have the 18-200, instead having the 18-55 and 55-200, which I had on my D40 and liked but got tired of constantly swapping back and forth all the time. It does come with the 50mm though. I don't much care about the other lenses, but the filters would be nice. Don't need a tripod but it doesn't really add to the price. Comes with 2 16 GB cards. The slave flash could be neat as I have never messed with off camera flashes.​
• D7000 18-55/55-200/55m, on body flash and cases
  
  
  This is basically the same as the kit above, except for the flash. This one has an on camera flash. No idea if it is a piece of junk or not. It also has the backpack and hard case. It's $90 more though.​
• D7000 and 18-200 only
  
  
  This one is just the 18-200 lens. Comes with the remote trigger, a book and DVD. Other than that, much the same as the other kits.​

I did some searching on B&H Photo and Adorama, but their kits were basically the body and lens, and maybe a memory card, all for the same price as the kits above with all the extra stuff. I searched Amazon as well and most of the kit deals there were just the same as the Cameta Camera kits I found on Ebay. I've never hear of Cameta Camera, but they have a superb rating on Ebay so I figure they can't be any worse than any of the other big names. I also searched Ritz Camera, because that is where I happened to get my D40 years ago, but they don't have much.

I am kind of leaning toward that last kit listed above and adding the 50mm/f1.8 later. Still... that 5100 is a lot cheaper...

Time for a refresher course.....


Read this first


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I went with the D7000, but this is my first digital camera (big one anyway) so I really can't compare it to anything. All I know is that I absolutely LOVE the quality of the photos that come out of it. I made a living as a pro gunner in the 70's and 80's using film of course - LOTS of weddings and senior portraits - quite a bit of drag race photography. I had to give it up when I found issues with focusing as I grew "older". The D7000 put me back in the game - love the camera! Maybe there is something better out there, but I'm perfectly happy with what I've got. And it's just the standard kit lens...

M38A1 said:

Time for a refresher course.....


Read this first


.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I have read several pieces similar to that. Experience in other fields of interests have driven home that the gear does not necessarily make the performer. Look at Skip Hunt and his work with a basic P&S! I love my P&S and take great shots with it... outdoors, not so much indoors.

Messing with my D40 the last few years, there were a few issues that drove me nuts. I bought it primarily for taking pics of family, kids playing, etc,... Indoors the 18-55 worked pretty good, but needed good light. Using the on board (built in) flash caused harsh lighting/shadows. This is where I am hoping the faster fixed lens and higher ISO abilities would do better without the need for a flash. An older AF 50/f1.8 is supposed to be good and cheap. The auto focus would work on the D90 or D7000, but not the D5100. Of course, given that the D5100 is cheaper than both the D90 and D7000, I could probably take the savings to pay for the newer AF-S 50mm.

When shooting pics of the kids outdoors, the simple fact is that I cannot keep up with them. One second they are right next to me and the next they are on the other side of the yard. Sure, I could move and use a fixed lens to change the composition, but dang... that would be a lot like exercise! A zoom is not the "best" lens, it is a compromise. The 55-200 I had worked pretty well outside, as did the 18-55, but I was constantly stuck swapping lenses and missing shots. The 200 end was plenty long enough for 99% of the shots, so there is no need to buy anything longer. Here is where I was hoping the 18-200 would work well.

As for the bodies, D90's usually cost more than the D5100. I could get a used one off E-bay, but I just have this thing... Besides, even used D90's are really not much cheaper than a new D5100. Given the newer tech, sensor, features, etc,... of the D5100/D7000 line of bodies, it seems silly to get the older D90. I held onto my D40 and lenses for five years, so I am not one of those guys that is constantly moving to the next best thing in bodies and lenses. In all likelihood, whatever camera/lenses I get will be what I keep for at least the next five years or more. It will NOT be a camera I use for bike trips. I use the P&S for that. It will sit on a shelf where I can grab it quickly for those impromptu shots around the house when the kids are playing, for birthdays, family gatherings, and maybe family vacations.

For the money, the D5100 looks like the way to go. The D7000 just scratches that gadget gene I have

Here's a nice side by side of the two if it helps any...
http://nikonites.com/d5100/2500-d5100-vs-d7000.html


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M38A1 said:

Here's a nice side by side of the two if it helps any...
http://nikonites.com/d5100/2500-d5100-vs-d7000.html


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Click to expand...

Oh yeah.. that helps It just makes me want the D7000 even more

I just got off the phone with a contractor. We are looking at replacing an exterior wall on our enclosed back porch. Whoever did the original job put the wall OFF the edge of the foundation It is also basically an all glass wall with two LARGE sliding glass doors facing South. It gets HOT in the room. A couple at our church wants to give us a really nice Yamaha baby grand piano for the kids to use to take lessons. Yeah, we were blown away when they told is this and we have seen the piano, very nice! But, the only room where we can put it is the enclosed back room. So we cannot have it getting super hot and not controlling the humidity. The new wall will be ON the foundation, framed, insulated, sheet rocked, etc,... So we can better control the environment in the room. This is something we've been wanting to do for a while and being offered the piano just kind of gave us the kick in the pants to get it done. The down side is between the cost of the construction and moving the piano, we're looking at close to $4K. So... the camera may have just got put on the back burner unless the Christmas spirit infects a lot of TWT users this month

TM. It is just my opinion, but if I was making the purchase tomorrow.

I would buy the D7000 and the 35mm 1.8.

You have a 70-300 that will work fine on a new body.

If your heart is still set on a 18-200mm lens, wait and buy it separately from ebay, or other online opportunity, used.

Duke said:

TM. It is just my opinion, but if I was making the purchase tomorrow.

I would buy the D7000 and the 35mm 1.8.

You have a 70-300 that will work fine on a new body.

If your heart is still set on a 18-200mm lens, wait and buy it separately from ebay, or other online opportunity, used.

Click to expand...

That is exactly what I would do as well. The only reason I didn't get the 7000 was because of space, but the 35mm 1.8 is THE best lens on the market for under $200 for the Nikons. And if you are crop sensor, like the 7000, 90, 40, 5100, then that gives you pretty much an effective 50mm field of view with just a little less lens compression.

Scott, up next for you will be off camera flash. Then available light becomes much less of a concern. When you get to that point, give me a shout. I have less than $200 in my off camera flash setup and it works like a dream.

You could also grab the 50mm f/1.8D version for $100 or less.

Duke said:

TM. It is just my opinion, but if I was making the purchase tomorrow.

I would buy the D7000 and the 35mm 1.8.

You have a 70-300 that will work fine on a new body.

If your heart is still set on a 18-200mm lens, wait and buy it separately from ebay, or other online opportunity, used.

Click to expand...

Is the 35mm 1.8 an AF-S lens (newer)?

DFW_Warrior said:

Scott, up next for you will be off camera flash. Then available light becomes much less of a concern. When you get to that point, give me a shout. I have less than $200 in my off camera flash setup and it works like a dream.

Click to expand...

That might be more of an experiment/play thing I get into at some point. But for just hanging out shooting casuals of the kids and such, I was hoping to get away from flashes.

klb1122 said:

You could also grab the 50mm f/1.8D version for $100 or less.

Click to expand...

I think this is the one I was thinking of. Supposed to be a great lens, cheap if you can find one used. I've seen several reviews that claim it is actually better than the newer and more expensive 50mm/1.8 lenses.

Of course, I may be getting stuff mixed up because of lenses originally designed for use with 35mm film versus the DX format sensor. Duke, is the lens you speak of a 35mm for 35mm film bodies that is the equivalent of 50mm when used on a DX sensor?

Using flash during daylight provides awesome results. The colors 'pop' more with the added contrast brought out by a flash unit. Even the popup flash will make them look better than if not used.

I am talking about the 35mm 1.8 DX lens. THIS ONE

It is a fantastic little lens. It will be basically a 50mm view on a DX body (yes even though it is built as a DX).

I would advise against the 50mm FX lens at this point. Not that it isn't a great lens, because it is. But it will be more of a portrait lens IMO as the view would be like a 75mm lens on a crop body. That gets a little long if taking a photo where you don't have much room to put between your subject and yourself.

I have the 18-200 mm lens, and most of my images are taken at 24~35mm and 200mm. Very little inbetween. (on my D90)

Now in my D800 which is full frame or FX body, when I shoot with my 24-70mm lens, I find that I shoot a lot of my images at the 50mm range. which is basically the same view I had on my D90 with the 35mm.

M38A1 said:

Using flash during daylight provides awesome results. The colors 'pop' more with the added contrast brought out by a flash unit. Even the popup flash will make them look better than if not used.

Click to expand...

Then I need to work on something. Too often the built in flash results in harsh lighting and/or harsh shadows when used indoors. I get much better results with the flash outdoors. Do we have a thread on techniques of using the flash?

Tourmeister said:

Then I need to work on something. Too often the built in flash results in harsh lighting and/or harsh shadows when used indoors. I get much better results with the flash outdoors. Do we have a thread on techniques of using the flash?

Click to expand...

Oooo Scott. Be careful, it is a slippery slope brother.

Here is one that Scott started.
http://www.twtex.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67233

and here is one that I started.
http://www.twtex.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57037


We really need to include Reflectors in the discussioon of off camera lighting too.

When you start talking about reflectors, umbrellas, etc,... that makes me think more of doing carefully planned photography, like a shooting session. It is possible I might get into that at some point, but for now I have not had much interest in it. I tend to shoot more casual and impromptu stuff where I won't have time to get all that stuff just right for the perfect shot.

I'll go read those threads anyway

Hmmm... Scott mentioned hunting for an SB-600 or even an SB-26. I have an SB-26 that I used with my N70 in the film days. It was barely used though. Is this something I would be able to use with the newer cameras like a D7000? Need some kind of adapter to use it on the camera? Useable as an off body flash?

It will work just fine. No adapter needed. You will end up with one though (an adapter that is), so you can get the flash off the top of your camera.

STScott said it best in one of his classes, "ray gun of death", or something similar.

I thought there was a voltage issue using the older flash with the newer DSLRs?

Tourmeister said:

I thought there was a voltage issue using the older flash with the newer DSLRs?

Click to expand...

Hmmmm... Let me look that up. I know it is true on the older Vivitars but I am not familiar with that being said about the SB-26.

Stand by.

EDIT: Yes it will work.

See here: http://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/886/kw/Sb-28/p/19,544/r_id/116678

Interesting. That also shows it should have worked with my D40, but I was never able to make it work

Did you have the camera in M mode and not in Auto?

The older (non-digital) flashes will not communicate with the camera in Auto mode from what I am reading. It will work in M, A or S modes though utilizing the TTL versus the iTTL.

Scott,

Tamron makes a 18-270 lens that you might have a look at. The advantage of the Tamron is that its image quality is on par with the Nikon 18-200 while being about $200+ less expensive. I bought the original version of the Tamron lens several years ago and have been pleased with its performance as an all-around lens. It is my go-to lens when using my Canon for travel, motorcycle, or casual shooting.

On the topic of flash, [ame="http://www.amazon.com/On-Camera-Techniques-Digital-Portrait-Photography/dp/1584282584"]this book is the bible[/ame] for getting the best results from a flash mounted on your camera (an external unit mounted on the camera, not the built-in flash). I highly recommend it to anyone wanting to improve their flash photography. You can achieve "off-camera flash" results with an on-camera flash when done properly.

I have Canon's version of the 50 f1.8 lens. For indoor casuals I get better results with on-camera flash and an 18-55 lens than with the 50mm without flash for several reasons. One is that I find the field of view on 50mm a bit too narrow for most indoor shooting. Second, while I love the shallow depth of field I get when using the 50 wide open (f1.8) for portraits, shooting at f1.8 indoors I find the depth of field is too shallow for group shots and for providing environmental context. Finally, I use an on-camera flash indoors as much to improve the quality of the light as I do to increase the quantity of light. Improving the quality of light can do more to improve your pictures than just about any other single thing you can do.

Duke said:

I am talking about the 35mm 1.8 DX lens. THIS ONE

It is a fantastic little lens. It will be basically a 50mm view on a DX body (yes even though it is built as a DX).

I would advise against the 50mm FX lens at this point. Not that it isn't a great lens, because it is. But it will be more of a portrait lens IMO as the view would be like a 75mm lens on a crop body. That gets a little long if taking a photo where you don't have much room to put between your subject and yourself.

Click to expand...

I would agree with you 100%, again. Basically this video does a decent job of explaining why a 50mm (35mm on a crop body) is one that everyone needs.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwmCrGVS3ZQ"]5 Reasons Why You Need a 50mm lens - YouTube[/ame]

So prime lens,

this [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Nikon-35mm-1-8G-Digital-Cameras/dp/B001S2PPT0/ref=pd_cp_p_0]Nikon 35mm f/1.8G AF-S DX[/ame] or this, [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Nikon-50mm-Nikkor-Digital-Cameras/dp/B00005LEN4/ref=pd_cp_p_2]Nikon 50mm f/1.8D AF[/ame]


Now, if I understand correctly, the 35mm AF-S will actually be 35mm because it is a DX lens, but the 50mm AF will be the equivalent of a 75mm because it is not a DX lens? Or am I missing something here...?

Close Scott.

The 35mm 1.8 DX will be like a 50mm Lens on crop body camera. Even though it is a DX lens.
The 50mm 1.8 will be like a 75mm Lens on a crop body camera.

Here is a comparison shot I took when I moved to full frame. For reference, the D90 is a Crop Body (DX) the D800 if Full Frame or (FX).

Notice how the 35mm lens on the full frame (D800) has a much wider view, compared to the 35mm on the crop body (D90) which has a much tighter view.

Yes that is the same 35mm 1.8 DX lens you have linked in your post. It works surprisingly well on the D800 too, just some slight vignetting on the edges, which is easily correcting in post. See Here