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FI Light Anyone?

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Screwcap

Screwcap

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Joined
Apr 16, 2008
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Location
Arizona
First Name
Vince
My FI light has came on three times. Everytime I have been on trips of 100+ miles but after I shut the bike off and restart it the light goes out. I took it into the shop and they told me that no fault codes are coming up and basically told me everything is okey dokey. Does anyone have any ideas how I can get to the bottom of this mysterious ghost light?
 
Piece of duct tape will fix that, ya know... :trust:
 
1st things 1st your dealer is an idiot go some where else. If you had a FI light then you have a fault code stored in the ECM. The only way to check what it sored now since you turned the key off before putting the bike in dealer mode is to find a dealer with a laptop that has the SDS software on it. Once hooked up you can retrieve the code under DTC inspection, trust me its there.:trust: It will tell you what exactly happened at the time of the fault. Do you have a O2 bypass? if not ignore my last question. We need more info before we can help you.
 
The vehicle in question is my 2007 bandit 1250s. I put a power commander with an o2 bypass but that was over 8 thousand miles ago. I didn't have the FI light until right around 10,900. I thought from what I read in previous places on this forum that the fault code would store in the ECM but I was told that there weren't any stored. The bike ran with the light and nothing strange happened. I just had to fuel up to finish my trip home so I shut it off. When I started back up it was gone. About 100 miles later it was back on. I shut it down and waited for the dealer to open. I made my appointment took it in and they said it was nothing. that is pretty much all the info and mods my bike has. I found their answers to be shady so I decided to ask for some help.
 
I really hope so I just figured that if it was gonna be the o2 censor it would have happened sooner. I didn't have anything come on for the 7-hour east arizona extravaganza I went on three months ago. but, really I was kinda hopeing for something like that compared the the worst case kinda stuff. Well gents and ladies I apperciate the feedback.
 
Can you pull O2 Bypass and see if the FI light comes on again? (Or would pulling the bypass mess with the PC map?)
 
I suspect the suggestion to pull the bypass implied plugging the O2 sensor back in again? It won't mess with any map that's loaded - worth a try, possibly.
 
That seems possible, however I am out of town for the next 2 weeks so I won't be able to run the bike on a 100 plus mile trip for probably a week or two after that because college is starting back up. I will post my findings when I finish this part of the investigation.
 
Sorry so late but after a through investigation by a person lacking a perfessional opinion I have came to the conclusion that the light is...the O2 sensor. Haven't had the problem with the bike light since the last time I posted I just had a problem with not having the internet... Everyone thank you for your help and input.
 
Screwcap said:
<SNIP>I am out of town for the next 2 weeks so I won't be able to run the bike on a 100 plus mile trip</SNIP>
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Coach, put me in, someone has to take one for the team. I volunteer to ride your bike over 100 miles and then swing by your dealer so he can read your code. For taking on the very difficult, time consuming, task I will expect all fuel to be paid for as well as lunch. I am not responsible for the shape your tires will be in upon your return.

Courageous of me, I know, but I am just that kind of guy.

I will also offer my garage for storage whenever you go out of town. Leave the key and a full tank of gas.
 
Screwcap said:
I thought from what I read in previous places on this forum that the fault code would store in the ECM but I was told that there weren't any stored. ... I made my appointment took it in and they said it was nothing. that is pretty much all the info and mods my bike has. I found their answers to be shady so I decided to ask for some help.
Click to expand...

What they mean is that when they use the short cable to pull the code it gets the -C00, they told me the same thing. I'm 98% sure it is the -C44 code we have all been seeing. PCIII and the DoBeck TFI O2 bypasses are/were/still suspect. I bet it was a warm day and you were between 4-5K in 6th when it went off. You need to replace the suspect O2 bypass and get a 'SDS' clean. Until you wipe the ECM it (FI light) will pop up all the time. This is a known issue and I still have not gotten the 'SDS' treatment yet, I have the latest and greatest O2 bypass from DoBeck but I still see 'the light'. Good luck with this. However, as you stated, the bike will run fine with the light on.

Cheers,

Mark
 
mi1lertm said:
Until you wipe the ECM it (FI light) will pop up all the time.
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No it won't. This has been said before - the FI light comes on to indicate a current fault - it has nothing to do with what might be stored in the ECU memory. What's stored in the memory can stay there for ever - an SDS clean is optional.

mi1lertm said:
I have the latest and greatest O2 bypass from DoBeck but I still see 'the light'.
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In that case you still have a current fault, probably (but not definitely) related to the O2 bypass. In my experience such an intermittent bypass fault will eventually lead to a complete failure of the resistor in the bypass.

Put the bike into dealer mode and see what fault code is displayed. Note, though, that the fault code will display only if the FI light is still on. If it's gone off again then there's no current fault to report on and you'll just get the -C00 code for the TPS.

mi1lertm said:
However, as you stated, the bike will run fine with the light on.
Click to expand...

It will run pretty well with the light on, but not as well as with it off. If the light stays on permanently (and it's because of code -C44) it's better to plug the O2 sensor back in until you can fix or replace the O2 bypass.
 
Hi Sproggy,

I understand what you are saying and I want to believe you, however, that does not seem to be the case with this bike. I have pulled my resister and bench tested it to X2 Ohm's and it works just fine. Both my dealer and other 'experts' (I am suspect of using that word for some of them) have seen this type of error on both the R1 and GSXR. Once you have a hard code stored in your ECM it will reappear until it is erased. I have reconnected my stock O2 sensor and tried to get it reappear with no success (which supports your point of view). I do not know the root cause of this issue and I wish you were correct. I have now been through 4 different O2 bypasses and now I am told that the last two seem to work on new owners who have not had the pleasure to buy their TFI while this was a current issue. In fact, Dobeck was a little P/O'd that all of us users kept complaining about this issue when they had fixed it. Mabey since you have a slightly different ECM or there is some other difference on you UK model you have not seen this issue when you fix'ed you bypass. There are to many instances of this issue here in the states for it to be a 'constant' current issue. I am not saying that there might be the few instances where the resister does go bad and you will have a current issue. But to have 4 resisters fail quickly is unlikly. Moreover, since it only gives you the 'light' when going closed loop and not when you stay in an open loop I agree that there is somthing else going on besides just resistance. Now that it is colder I never see the light anymore, and I will have the SDS clean when I bring my bike in for the valve adjust (I'm at ~14K miles now).

Cheers,

Mark
 
I tested my O2 sensor many times and it always showed the correct resistance. Until it failed completely. But when you test it it's cold. The popular (and perfectly plausible) theory is that the resistor gets hot and this changes its resistance, takes it out of the acceptable range and triggers the light. Eventually these heat cycles kill the resistor completely and it goes open-circuit.

The fact that you have had several bypasses give the same warning is simply an indication that Dobeck aren't providing you with one that has a resistor with a high enough power rating. Did yours fail completely or simply show the FI light and then return to normal resistance again?

The colder weather now is probably helping your bypass keep cool enough to continue working - it's a marginal issue by all accounts.

I've done a couple of thousand miles since fixing the bypass myself (with a higher-wattage resistor) and the light has not reappeared once. And I'm sure it never will. But I still have the code stored in the ECU. Sure, the US and Euro ECUs are slightly different but only in that they're loaded with a different map - I can think of no reason why Suzuki would design in different fault reporting for different markets - that would make no sense.

mi1lertm said:
I have now been through 4 different O2 bypasses and now I am told that the last two seem to work on new owners.......... But to have 4 resisters fail quickly is unlikly.
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Clearly your resistors haven't failed if other people have used your old bypasses. Sure, they've heated up and changed resistance enough to throw the FI light up but they haven't failed completely. You've pointed out that the fault only comes up under certain conditions (engine revs, ambient temperature, light throttle) so maybe these other people just haven't experienced those conditions yet. Maybe they never will.

Believe what you will, but check the manual - the FI light indicates a current fault. No light = no current fault. The light does not report historical faults. And in reference to your mention of the R1 and GSXR, well, we're talking about a Bandit with a completely different ECU so that comparison is irrelevant. You might as well compare it with the ECU in a Ford.

I suspect that the only way you'll believe me is to get your ECU memory cleared with SDS and then ride through another summer. Your light will still come on under the same conditions despite the fact that there's nothing stored, and then you'll realise that I and the other people who've said the same thing on various threads are right ;-) And then you'll go out and spend 20 cents on a resistor, fix the problem yourself, and never see the light again. :rider:
 
I agree with you on most aspects, however, I did not test the resistance on a 'hot' resister. I came at my dealer with ths same attitude as you have with my manual in hand stating the same thing. This is why I used the word 'expert' lightly. My point is that if I have a stored code that could/will trigger the 'FI' light I should be able to reproduce it using the stock O2 sensor. And since I could not trigger the fail under those conditions there must be somthing else going on. DoBeck has now issues +5 watt (still have not striped it down to the bands yet) but it is very thick and should be able to take far more wattage then needed (they are now going for the over kill). But I still see the light, could be that their shrink wrap holds in heat causing resistance to fail while hot ( I have tried to explain free space prematitivy and resistance to these guys a few times) but the issue still remaines the same. What are you using? Let me know what works and I will build me one of those and see if the light goes away. If it does, I will have a few free beers on the dealer.

Cheers,

Mark
 
mi1lertm said:
I agree with you on most aspects, however, I did not test the resistance on a 'hot' resister.
Click to expand...

That's the trouble - by the time you've got home, stopped, taken the side panel off and got to the bypass the resistor has cooled down again so checks out fine!

mi1lertm said:
Let me know what works and I will build me one of those and see if the light goes away.
Click to expand...

I used a 1k, 0.5w resistor which I think is the same as Roy used. My Dynojet bypass had a 330 ohm, 0.125w resistor (well, I think it was 0.125w) that I'd taken the shrink wrap off already. This suggests that the resistance is less critical (within reason) than the power rating.

It's a bit of a fiddly job to remove the two connectors from the housing, solder a new resistor onto them and then replace but it solved the problem for me. Good luck! Although you probably won't be able to tell for sure whether it's solved the problem until you get some more hot weather.
 
I have three couplers from past bypasses, you are using what I had for my third bypass, it was a 0.5W with 1K resistance, I took off the shrink wrap on the second day since it failed on the first ride. It still failed W/O the wrap. I believe the first bypass was 1/8th watt and 330 Ohm in epoxy, 2nd was same but in a gel substance, 3rd (I just told you) and now they stated that it was an issue with two much resistance (causing heat issue) and not enough wattage so I now have a very fat resister I'm guessing > 5 watt with low reistance (330 ohm ?). So I believe that I have used the same resistance as you currently enjoy. I will stop by Raido Shack and pick one for my self and see if it works any better, but since it is now < 45 F I do not know if I will be able to tell.

Thanks for the info,

Cheers,

Mark.

p.s. as if you did not notice, I work over nights (20:00 - 09:00) so that is why I am on your time.
 
Wanted to toss out some research I've been doing on this issue. I have an '09 GSF1250S with a Dobeck EFI controller and Holeshot slip-on exhaust. I purchased it with that equipment on it. The previous owner (in St. Pete, FL) said he never got the FI light once. I, however, got it on the 75 mile ride home. Since I don't like warning lights, I did some research and have been in contact with the people at Holeshot and Dobeck. I have also instrumented the bike and found out some interesting things that I don't think the people in the tech department at Dobeck were aware of previously.

Note: I have not yet actually solved the issue, but I am making progress. I can say that it is not as simple as changing a resistor, so if you've been fortunate enough to keep the light off after doing that, it's because knowingly or unknowingly you have altered your throttle habit.

The trail thus far is at http://www.ratpackcycles.com/skpage/SuzukiBandit1250/SuzukiBandit1250.htm if you'd like the full details. No, I'm not selling anything and I'm not asking for donations. I want to actually solve the FI light issue. Any help y'all can offer would be appreciated.
 
Over 35,000 miles on an '08 1250 with Dobeck, FI lamp comes on:
WHEN: More often than not, it comes on when I'm cruising at a steady speed on the freeway, usually at 73mph +-.
AMBIANT TEMPS: Always seems to be on a hot day. However it came on recently when I thought the ambiant conditions were not really that hot..... found out a couple days ago I've been riding for over 5,000 miles on my oil, and the level was beneath the indicator window.

I've had luck a couple times at freeway speeds killing the engine with my key, leaving the engine off long enough for the ECU to recognize the condition, then snap the key back on and let the clutch out.
Otherwise I pull over and treat her with the respect she actually deserves, turning the engine off along-side the frwy.
 
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