Thoughts about forum user participation numbers: past, present, and future...

[Tourmeister]

The big issue is how to get people to see/know the password, especially if they are using TT since I don't have control over how stuff looks. Let me give it some thought.

 

[jqueen]

I think some people (I was one at first) cant stop themselves from responding to some of the political stuff, even though they intend to leave it alone. The ability to ignore or password protect helps keep the politics from overrunning the feed, and also helps focus the political discussions to those that actually want to participate, not just flame the topic.

I didn't like that the other off topic was lumped in with politics, but it wasn't a problem.

 

[Jarrett]

As a newbie to motorcycles and TWT, but not a newbie to hobby-specific discussion forums, I feel like TWT is very a cool place. Well run with mostly a good bunch of folks. I've found almost everyone I've met from here to be good people. That's pretty rare, imo.

In general, I think that the hobby of riding motorcycles AND the concept of community-based discussion forums are in decline. I see it with a lot of my other "old man" hobbies as well. I think its just that. For the most part, TWT appeals to a certain aging demographic that is declining. I think the forum numbers reflect that.

Personally, I'm not sure how to reverse that. But I'm glad to be a part of it now and grateful for what TWT represents. Riding motorcycles would certainly be less fun without TWT, imo.

And I get the clique group ride thing as well. Not everyone wants a newbie along for the ride, I get that. Free time is limited, so might as well spend it riding with those folks that you already know and feel comfortable riding with.

 

[Aspear]

One reason why I like Twt is that it's of an older than me demographic. Im 26, I try to surround myself with people who have more experience than me. Whether it's motorcycles, hunting/shooting, my career or life in general.

I find alot of my generation annoying, idiotic and in alot of cases just plain stupid. But I'm sure that's how alot of yall would/do feel about me(shut up jmz [emoji1787]).

 

[Tourmeister]

As a newbie to motorcycles and TWT, but not a newbie to hobby-specific discussion forums, I feel like TWT is very a cool place. Well run with mostly a good bunch of folks. I've found almost everyone I've met from here to be good people. That's pretty rare, imo.

In general, I think that the hobby of riding motorcycles AND the concept of community-based discussion forums are in decline. I see it with a lot of my other "old man" hobbies as well. I think its just that. For the most part, TWT appeals to a certain aging demographic that is declining. I think the forum numbers reflect that.

Personally, I'm not sure how to reverse that. But I'm glad to be a part of it now and grateful for what TWT represents. Riding motorcycles would certainly be less fun without TWT, imo.

That is good to hear.

And I get the clique group ride thing as well. Not everyone wants a newbie along for the ride, I get that. Free time is limited, so might as well spend it riding with those folks that you already know and feel comfortable riding with.

As a Dad with three kids entering their teen years and with a job that has me on 24 hour emergency call, I get the whole limited time issue.

Back when I had more time, I used to host Newbie Rides. These were intentionally geared toward riders that were new to riding, solo or in groups. I'd generally have everyone meet at my home about an hour before we would actually leave. In that hour, I would go over some real basic rules of the road for group riding. Had to keep them simple and few or folks would just forget or ignore them (like forum rules ). We would talk about basic riding techniques, like slow in/fast out, and slow, look, lean, roll. We would talk about sag and help people set it up on their bikes if their suspension was adjustable. We would check chain slack. I would give a brief description of how the ride was going to go so people would know what to expect.

One thing I REALLY stressed was the reality that a group ride is NOT a bunch of riders doing their own thing without regard to everyone else! It is a group of riders riding together and thinking about the group dynamics the whole time. I stressed keeping track of each other. I stressed not trying to impress everyone and sucking newbies in over their heads. I stressed not acting the idiot so that the general public would be annoyed with us, especially when the groups got into any traffic or in passing situations.

I would lead and my wife generally brought up the rear. We used communicators to keep track of how the group was doing. I would encourage experienced riders to attend as well, then stagger the group so newbies were generally following an experienced rider. This let them see what a good rider was doing, but also let a good rider watch them from behind. I would keep the pace subdued because I did not want the new riders feeling pressured to ride above their heads. At stops, I would encourage people to talk about what they were experiencing and seeing. At lunch we'd have longer discussions. After lunch, new riders would try to put into practice what they were seeing and learning. These rides were popular and folks really got a lot out of them. Sadly, I just ran out of time to do them and no one else picked up where I left off.

As much as I like riding with known riders that I am familiar with, I found that I really enjoyed helping the new riders and seeing their understanding and skills improve. I DID require a full face helmet, gloves, and a jacket. No doubt, that might have turned a few folks off. So be it. My reasoning to the group was that I had seen accidents where people had no gear and had no desire to see it again or have to deal with it if it could be avoided. Interestingly, many riders would see the gear we were wearing and start asking questions about what kind of gear to get, where to get it, etc,... Many eventually ended up becoming ATGATT without being pressured or harassed about it.

I wish I could do similar rides now. However, my schedule barely allows me time to get out to ride at all

 

[Meriden]

didn't like that the other off topic was lumped in with politics, but it wasn't a problem.

Yes, I seem to recall that we had a trailer thread booted to off topic because it was not about motorcycles. It's a fine line sometime.

For those of you that DO NOT want to see the OT content, let me know if OT content shows up in the "NEW POSTS" lists for you.

I'm still seeing off topic in the New Posts feed. I'm pretty good at ignoring it these days, some others may not be.

 

[echavez]

used to host Newbie Rides. These were intentionally geared toward riders that were new to riding, solo or in groups. I'd generally have everyone meet at my home about an hour before we would actually leave. In that hour, I would go over some real basic rules of the road for group riding. Had to keep them simple and few or folks would just forget or ignore them (like forum rules ). We would talk about basic riding techniques, like slow in/fast out, and slow, look, lean, roll. We would talk about sag and help people set it up on their bikes if their suspension was adjustable. We would check chain slack. I would give a brief description of how the ride was going to go so people would know what to expect.

as a newbie rider I would have loved doing something like that

 

[Mextrekadv]

I miss the landing page showing up when I type TWTEX in google. I navigated everywhere from that page, hardly ever actually went into the forums. Same as I used to do on Motohouston. The landing page is essential to peaking interest. A listing of subforums and posts makes for a stale web experience. In my humble opinion the forums are too specialized. I find myself digging in 3 or 4 sub forums to find the thread I remember reading.

The email alerts are key as well.

Other gizmos come and go. The forum should stand the test of time.

 

[Tourmeister]

I miss the landing page as well. I don't know why but that seems to be a divisive issue among the XF developers. I would think that should be a default part of the package, but it is not and they don't seem all that enthused about helping people get one set up. There are some work arounds, but at this point they are still beyond my technical skill to implement. So I am still hunting for a solution.

 

[Jeff S]

I only ever come to TWT via a bookmark to 'New Posts'... even mobile.

 

[mitchntx]

I think some people (I was one at first) cant stop themselves from responding to some of the political stuff, even though they intend to leave it alone. The ability to ignore or password protect helps keep the politics from overrunning the feed, and also helps focus the political discussions to those that actually want to participate, not just flame the topic.

I didn't like that the other off topic was lumped in with politics, but it wasn't a problem.

The new software's ignore feature is wonderful.
The folks on my ignore list are absolutely invisible where before there was always a footprint visible.
It has made my TWT experience so much better.

I only ever come to TWT via a bookmark to 'New Posts'... even mobile.

Same here ... much more streamlined experience.
The downside, visiting only occasionally makes the "New Posts" list quite long.

 

[Mark_M]

I would like to add something here as a returning member who was inactive for a few years due to not riding that THIS IS BY FAR THE BEST FORUM for the GENERAL motorcycling community that I have come across. I agree that most of us here are 40+ here ( except me I just turned 21 last month )and unlike the wheelie popping video recording and posting everything they do in their life online millennials we tend to take things a little slower and read more than post IMHO. FB is now considered old and outdated meant for oldies like me and has been replaced by Twitter, Instagram, snapchat and other platforms of Time wasting internet gadgetry I don't know of or care to learn about lol. Also I am a member of the Vmaxforum.net, Fz6 forum and most recently The Vulcan forum. Those forums are virtually dead, no one hardly responds to queries and there is no comradery among the members. TWT has always given me a feeling of being among friends and family a kind of a comfort zone. And as far as your numbers Scott I think you are probably doing much better than most of the forums out there. I also agree that there is so much content on the internet nowadays it probably keeps newer members from reaching sites and forums like these. This is exactly why every company out there is spending tons of cash on SEO and online banner advertising to draw people to their web sites. So the future progress of this site when it comes to new members will greatly depend on what you do to drive them to the website instead of thinking that they will just find their way here somehow. I compare it to herding cattle, the herd goes towards the area where they are driven and that is the truth about todays internet habits.
That being said I love being here and reading through the vast variety of information stored here and keeping in touch with like minded individuals. And I will always
be glad to be here.

 

[Tourmeister]

Thanks Mark,

Word used to get out via links from other websites, blogs, personal sites, etc,... For a while, there were even some dealers that were telling people about us. Lone Star BMW was good in that regard. Also, just word of mouth from riders meeting other riders played a HUGE part. There were a few years where I printed up around 500 business cards and went to the Dallas bike shows, and left cards on almost every bike in the parking lot, but I never really liked doing that, so I quit. I even did a bit of advertising at one time, but that costs a LOT of money for very little return. Does anyone even read printed bike mags anymore? I still meet random riders and eventually get around to mentioning the forum during a visit. The Bandit MEGA thread certainly brought a LOT of Bandit riders from all over the world here!

 

[julimike54]

@mitchntx ^^Ditto^^

 

[julimike54]

Thanks Mark,

SNIP Does anyone even read printed bike mags anymore? I still meet random riders and eventually get around to mentioning the forum during a visit. The Bandit MEGA thread certainly brought a LOT of Bandit riders from all over the world here!

I still read AMA Motorcyclist, Rider and last year Road Runner.

 

[Jarrett]

Does anyone even read printed bike mags anymore?

I picked up a copy of Ride Texas at the last show and after reading it, I kinda want to subscribe to it.

Would be my first magazine subscription in possibly... 15 years?

 

[2WheelNut]

That is good to hear.



As a Dad with three kids entering their teen years and with a job that has me on 24 hour emergency call, I get the whole limited time issue.

Back when I had more time, I used to host Newbie Rides. These were intentionally geared toward riders that were new to riding, solo or in groups. I'd generally have everyone meet at my home about an hour before we would actually leave. In that hour, I would go over some real basic rules of the road for group riding. Had to keep them simple and few or folks would just forget or ignore them (like forum rules ). We would talk about basic riding techniques, like slow in/fast out, and slow, look, lean, roll. We would talk about sag and help people set it up on their bikes if their suspension was adjustable. We would check chain slack. I would give a brief description of how the ride was going to go so people would know what to expect.

One thing I REALLY stressed was the reality that a group ride is NOT a bunch of riders doing their own thing without regard to everyone else! It is a group of riders riding together and thinking about the group dynamics the whole time. I stressed keeping track of each other. I stressed not trying to impress everyone and sucking newbies in over their heads. I stressed not acting the idiot so that the general public would be annoyed with us, especially when the groups got into any traffic or in passing situations.

I would lead and my wife generally brought up the rear. We used communicators to keep track of how the group was doing. I would encourage experienced riders to attend as well, then stagger the group so newbies were generally following an experienced rider. This let them see what a good rider was doing, but also let a good rider watch them from behind. I would keep the pace subdued because I did not want the new riders feeling pressured to ride above their heads. At stops, I would encourage people to talk about what they were experiencing and seeing. At lunch we'd have longer discussions. After lunch, new riders would try to put into practice what they were seeing and learning. These rides were popular and folks really got a lot out of them. Sadly, I just ran out of time to do them and no one else picked up where I left off.

As much as I like riding with known riders that I am familiar with, I found that I really enjoyed helping the new riders and seeing their understanding and skills improve. I DID require a full face helmet, gloves, and a jacket. No doubt, that might have turned a few folks off. So be it. My reasoning to the group was that I had seen accidents where people had no gear and had no desire to see it again or have to deal with it if it could be avoided. Interestingly, many riders would see the gear we were wearing and start asking questions about what kind of gear to get, where to get it, etc,... Many eventually ended up becoming ATGATT without being pressured or harassed about it.

I wish I could do similar rides now. However, my schedule barely allows me time to get out to ride at all

I'd love to start these up again. Not all the time but maybe one every couple of months. I've got a decent garage / work area where I could help people understand some basic maintenance and what to look for to keep their bikes safe and I've ridden enough different bikes and kinds of terrain over the year to be able to help most newbies with the basics.

When you get done with all of this forum software migration stuff, let me know and I'd like to pick your brain a bit on what worked and what didn't.

My biggest problem, or maybe it's an asset TBD, is that I'm in the middle of the DFW metromess. A good ride for me starts with getting out of the mess and to decent roads and that's usually 40 or 50 miles right away. The good is that I can teach how to ride as a group through a city or on a highway to get to decent roads, the bad is that we'd have to and that's not really that fun.

 

[Tourmeister]

I'd love to start these up again. Not all the time but maybe one every couple of months. I've got a decent garage / work area where I could help people understand some basic maintenance and what to look for to keep their bikes safe and I've ridden enough different bikes and kinds of terrain over the year to be able to help most newbies with the basics.

When you get done with all of this forum software migration stuff, let me know and I'd like to pick your brain a bit on what worked and what didn't.

My biggest problem, or maybe it's an asset TBD, is that I'm in the middle of the DFW metromess. A good ride for me starts with getting out of the mess and to decent roads and that's usually 40 or 50 miles right away. The good is that I can teach how to ride as a group through a city or on a highway to get to decent roads, the bad is that we'd have to and that's not really that fun.

That would be awesome. Most of the "mechanical" stuff we did could be done with the basic tools most Adventure/Dualsport riders carry on their bikes. For anything more than that, I would host a maintenance day/cookout at my place. These usually included work like changing tires, changing sprockets and chain, maybe flushing fork oil and changing preload spacers, changing oil, changing brake pads, cleaning/replace air filters, basic electrical accessories, and other pretty simple stuff. We never got into the engines or did things like valves (unless it was an air/oil cooled GS with screw/tappets). I'd usually fire up the grill and do burgers and hot dogs. If people wanted, I'd let them ship tires to the house ahead of time, but they HAD to take the old tires with them or give me money to pay for disposal. I had enough of my own old tires filling up my garage.

Most of the stuff I did just for the newbie rides you could probably do in a parking lot. So you could just have folks meet at a start place outside of the metromess. Just bring zip ties, at least 9" long for use in setting sag and marking fork movement. You'll also need a basic tape measure or even a 12" plastic ruler.

I would not recommend trying to set up group communications for the whole group. It will take forever and the odds of it working well are slim to none. Having a lead and sweep rider that could communicate was great. That helped a lot with determining whether I needed to bring the pace down more. It also helped when the more skilled riders approached me to let me know about how a particular newbie might be doing. Then I'd try to get alone to talk with them and get their feedback and maybe make suggestions.

Almost every time I did one of these rides someone would claim I was going crazy fast. I'd tell them that I never went over the speed limit. They'd never believe me until I showed them the GPS info for max speed. What was happening is that I was not slowing as much for the corners so my average speed stayed higher. We'd get the bungy thing going. People would slow waaaayyy down for a corner (which was good) but then they would go like crazy on the straights because they wanted to be right behind the person in front of them (not so good). To do this, they were running WAY faster than I ever did. So I started going through the corners at my fun speed, then going real slow on the straights to wait for people to bunch back up to prevent them from doing the straight line blitzes. I would also constantly remind people that I would stop at each intersection and wait for the whole group to gather up, so there was no worries about losing the group and getting separated.

It takes a little work on the part of the ride organizer, but it can be really fun. I got a lot of great positive feedback from the riders that participated, skilled and newbies. I'd usually ask that people be at my home (or a start point) by 9:00am and we'd usually be KSU by 10:00am. We would usually do a late lunch stop somewhere around 1:00pm. Then we'd be back home around 5:00pm. Ride lengths varied from 200-250 miles.

 

[KiwiTex]

IMHO having been a member of many sites in many places over the years, what has always motivated me ( and seems to have worked for others) is the personal connections made with others of like mind and endeavor. The forum itself is really only a facilitator of those real life experiences. Like any club or group, the real value is in the living of the shared experience, not the keyboarding.
The most successful sites seem to me to have at the core, a frequent and fun set of activities that are well advertised, well attended and then well re-hashed after the event.
This site seems to do that well, although due to my injuries I have been unable to partake much, I am hopeful that will change later this year.
On another site far away, I ran a mentors training tips night every week for whoever showed up. It was a lot of fun, practiced simple but useful skills that anyone of any level could benefit from.
It was a great thing but it takes a big commitment of time, which is what most folks seem to have little of. Which might be the real problem really.

My advice, take it for what it cost, send out a reminder each day of about 100 folks who used to frequent the site, with a few teasers on 'hot new' threads.
See how that goes after a month or two, it might be more productive than just bulk mailing 'hey we miss you' type stuff (not sure if that was what you intended)

Personally, I like the no swearing. It makes it much more fun when you disagree with someone, you can't simply hurl insults at each other. It forces you to work for a more reasoned response, although it could be argued that simply wastes more of your effort in arguing with a fool.

 

[Zephyr]

"Does anyone even read printed bike mags anymore?"

My subscription to Rider is still current since I enjoy the tour reports. All others (5) weren't renewed. I seriously considered renewing Motorcycle Consumer News since it's the last one that has full data: Dyno runs, 0-60, 60-0, top speed,1/4 mile, all specs, and rated by the testers. Once a year they published a summary of all prior their tests. But the rate is now $46/year. I enjoy the occasional British motorcycle magazines I buy at Barnes & Noble. They seem to be written by true motorcycle enthusiasts.

 

[Aspear]

I'm subscribed to Racer X and I get a bmw airheads newsletter and read them both. I sometimes read my land surveying magazines I get for free.

I prefer traditional print magazines to digital.

 

[copb8]

"Does anyone even read printed bike mags anymore?"

I used to be an avid paper magazine subscriber but more and more I'm letting those subscriptions lapse. Due to the declining subscription rates most paper magazines have less and less content, to the point of being worthless. Second, by the time I get the magazine most of the hot topics have been covered on the net already.

 

[copb8]

I have 3 forums I follow multiple times a day and 3 more I follow once a day. In almost all cases I utilize the "New Posts" button. It's very quick to scan through the posts to see if I have an interest or not.

I've used the ignore feature on a couple of other forums with great results. I really haven't had to use it on TWT though.

 

[Tourmeister]

IMHO having been a member of many sites in many places over the years, what has always motivated me ( and seems to have worked for others) is the personal connections made with others of like mind and endeavor. The forum itself is really only a facilitator of those real life experiences. Like any club or group, the real value is in the living of the shared experience, not the keyboarding.The most successful sites seem to me to have at the core, a frequent and fun set of activities that are well advertised, well attended and then well re-hashed after the event.
This site seems to do that well, although due to my injuries I have been unable to partake much, I am hopeful that will change later this year.

This is really what I set out to do in the very beginning. It was my main motivation for even starting the forum. It is still where I try to place my focus with everything that I do with the site.

On another site far away, I ran a mentors training tips night every week for whoever showed up. It was a lot of fun, practiced simple but useful skills that anyone of any level could benefit from.
It was a great thing but it takes a big commitment of time, which is what most folks seem to have little of. Which might be the real problem really.

Time... the thing that seems to be everywhere, that we all seem to take for granted when we are young, and yet we never have enough of it as we age... The irony is that no matter what, real relationships take TIME. There just isn't anyway to get around this. We are often reluctant to invest too much time in people, and yet doing so is the only way to enjoy really satisfying relationships. By necessity, this means we are limited in the number of truly good quality relationships we can maintain. It takes serious effort and commitment.

I would love to be able to do this motorcycle stuff full time and actually be able to pay bills so I could get out from under the time sucking regular job I have. Then I could put my time and effort into planning rides and events like I did in the first few years of the forum. The problem is that the site is no where close to paying any real bills, other than my hosting fees and maybe a set of tires every now and then. Over time, it has paid for my bikes, both bought used and now 12 and 9 years old. So I am pretty well stuck with the job I have that does not give me much in the way of vacation time or even predictable time off during normal times. It is very frustrating. So I have no choice but to hope other users will step up every now and then to organize stuff.

Over the years when there have been people that step up to organize rides/events, I have always been glad to help with any advice or guidance I can give. I am grateful for those folks. Off the top of my head I am thinking of Wczimmerman, Gilk51, and Focus Frenzy for the Pie Runs. BeemerlessBob has done a lot of the campouts. Rod "Mr2Mch" has organized rides and the Stromathon events. Dody "Ghostrider1964" has done many events, and even has one coming up this weekend or next weekend I think. Kickstand Prophet has done regular meet & greets. Not all these are TWT specific, but they still benefit TWT users. Having Richard "Trail Boss" and the rest of the Texas Adventure guys present on the site has helped as well. I don't even know all the folks that setup and keep the regular bike nights, lunches, and weekend rides going, but I appreciate the efforts of all of them!!

All I can say to anyone that might be thinking of organizing something is DO IT! Don't overthink the details. You will NEVER find a date that satisfies everyone. The vast majority of the people that attend will be happy with how things turn out. There might be a few that gripe about one thing or another, but that will always be the case. IF they are so unhappy, let them organize their own events and see how it goes for them When I plan a ride/trip/gathering, I pick the time and dates that work best for me, then I let the chips fall where they may. It usually works out fine unless the weather just literally blows things away!

 

[jqueen]

All I can say to anyone that might be thinking of organizing something is DO IT! Don't overthink the details. You will NEVER find a date that satisfies everyone. The vast majority of the people that attend will be happy with how things turn out. There might be a few that gripe about one thing or another, but that will always be the case. IF they are so unhappy, let them organize their own events and see how it goes for them When I plan a ride/trip/gathering, I pick the time and dates that work best for me, then I let the chips fall where they may. It usually works out fine unless the weather just literally blows things away!

RE: ride planning/organizing- I need to do it more. My problem right now is most of my day rides are spur of the moment, and my planned rides tend to be multi-day and usually just family - but I would like to invite others along. I worry on the multi-day rides that I'll end up with somebody who has drastically different preferences. I don't mind spreading out and regrouping at turns or every 15 minutes, but I participated in one ride that turned a 3 hour trip into 8 hours because we stopped every 30 minutes - I don't want to get stuck with that on a multi-day ride (nothing wrong with it, just not my thing)..


For the day ride planning, don't overthink it - I haven't done a lot of it, but I started the SHNF ride thread which was used regularly for several years (maybe still - I'm not near SHNF any more). I also started the East Texas 450 ride one year, and I think there have been a few small ones as well.

In all cases, I didn't do a lot of organizing, I just basically posted an announcement, invited others, and it went from there. For the East Texas ride, there were a few calls to camp sites to make sure they had space.


So while the highly organized rides are AWESOME to see going on, it's not actually necessary - if you don't have the time/inclination to go that far, just be clear about a couple of things:

1 - if there are any hard stops to who you're willing to ride with (must have ATTGATT for example - I don't personally care but some riders won't ride in a group if some of the others aren't geared up)

2 - are you LEADING, or are you just another guy riding with the group who happens to be in front? (doesn't mean you don't look out for others, but you aren't taking responsibility to map out gas stops every 100 miles if you have 300 mile range, etc)

3 - Make some effort to describe the pace - for me on pavement it would be something like - "we generally don't break the speed limit on the straight portions, or at least not by much, but generally more than 15 over the yellow recommended signs for corners. I don't care if everybody rides that pace, I don't mind waiting and I don't mind being waited on, but that's how fast myself and my normal ride companions run."