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HB2470 / HB3838 "Malories Law" - Foot Pegs and Grab Handles

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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

I just don't get how the people who are our professional "lawmakers" can't get this stuff right. Targeting exactly one kind of bike because a 'concerned citizen' wanted it that way is just beyond stupid. Using that logic we need to create a separate law for every single bike style, brand, color, you name it, everytime someone has a fatal accident.

It's basically the same logic as requiring a special condition to drive a Ford F-150 because someone ran a light and hit a pedestrian once.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

jeepinbanditrider said:
What was the comment?
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I basically said the bill was nonsense and that I'd contacted the AMA about it. I had a nasty email waiting the next time I logged in:

Natalie Bullock said:
Hey *** hole please don't write on my sisters law..my family and I have been thru ****. It will pass and you will be sorry
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To which I replied in my usual heartfelt way:

Tim Kreitz said:
I'm sorry already. Your legislation will result in more runners, more pursuits, and more death. Your loss has apparently turned you into emotionally misguided, overzealous idiots.

Better than half the teens riding sportbikes these days don't even have a ******* motorcycle license or insurance. What good do you think laws that discriminate against owners of sportbikes are going to do? I've got news for you honey, more people die on cruisers than sportbikes.

This is just another stupid, unenforceable law that'll only serve to hinder and hassle law-abiding riders. Now will I have to be worried about getting pulled over every time I take my wife for a ride, just because of the kind of bike I own? I've been riding for 33 years. Thanks, but I don't need your good intentions.

I'm telling you that your law is pure bull****. Will it pass? Probably. Lots of bull**** laws do.

If you wanna give your loved one's death some meaning, support the AMA or rider awareness and safety programs. But don't use your grief as an excuse to discriminate and aggress against guys like me.
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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Awesome :)
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Hey guys, I'm with you on the poor thought behind this law. I received my "M" at 15 and by this law would be ready to ride with a passenger at 18... and at 18 I was riding like an idiot.

But let me share some insight as someone who has worked with state lawmakers in the past. In their eyes getting into a pissing contest with the victim will likely hurt your cause as much as any rider organization might help it. I'm not saying not to try and stop the law, just don't let it devolve into personal insults and moderate the rhetoric.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Tim,
while I think your methods could have used a little polish :) , your message is 110% spot on. I just cant believe that she'd come out guns a-blazin'.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

McHaven said:
I'm all for requiring riders to have 2 years experience before carrying a passenger. Riding with a passenger changes everything about the bike, and you really need to know your bike, and your skills inside and out to do it safely. I don't agree with making it style-specific though.
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EVERYONE! Not a specific model!
Discrimination!

SRAD
Mr Marie
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

poser said:
yeah, because Mr. Midlifecrisis who goes out and buys an 800 Harley know exactly what he's doing. After all, he is wearing a bandanna, that makes him an expert. And his passenger is so much safer too :rollseyes:
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:-P:-P:-P:-P Perfect!
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

I'm with Tim. If her response refers to me as "*******" in the first three words, she's open to the full barrage of the unabridged English language. :biggun:


While I'm at it, Corey, I'm not so sure you're doing motorcyclists any favors by assimilating us to "rebels" or "Easy Riders of the 60s and 70s". That surely will sit well with the old women of the round table.
 
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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

This has got to fail surely? I wonder if my KTM Superduke is a sportbike? Optizimed for speed and handling - Yes. Leans forward over the tank- NO. What about a Bandit and similar machines? Personally I would call those a standard, certainly not a sportbike. What would the law define those as? Sport tourers, I wonder where they fit? It's not about the bike, it about training and attitude. When a kid shoots himself in the head with his Dad's gun everyone is quick to say it has nothing to do with guns. Isn't this the same thing?
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

So next time someone asks me if my GS is a sport bike I can say, only if I lean over the gas tank.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

I posted on the wall there, basically saying its wrong to discriminate against a style, or pass legislation that will effect an entire community where a few bad apples have misrepresented us, where all motorcycles have similar inherent risks and its always a personal choice to get on the back of a motorcycle, and one should never make a decision lightly. I also said there was a lot of ignorance about motorcycles and motorcycling on their page. (What's a light-weight bike? My bike is 400 pounds. Rather light in comparison to most. Is it a light-weight bike? It has double disc brakes, so it must be designed to brake well following rapid acceleration. Is it a sport bike now?)

I can't give you the full text of my comment, cause they've deleted, but here's the responses I received from them.

Malorie's Law wrote: "Mr Haven we all have choices but you are mistaken about the risk of this type of bike. I suggest that you proceed with your research and you will see what we are promoting. We are only promoting education. Perhaps if the young man had taken into consideration his lack of experience and my daughters lack of ever riding any type of motorcycle or even a four wheeler she would still be alive today. We are not against motorcycles at all we want education. We want safety to be important to all and we do not want one more family to have to go thru what we have gone thru. You call us ignorant and I would like for you to perhaps look at this from our position. We are not wanting bans on anyones rights."
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"You mention bad apples does that include the idiots that I have seen on sport bikes weaving in and out of traffic and driving at high rates of speed without concern for others around them. Does this also include those individuals that place there small children on the front of these machines without having any protection at all yes I am a grieving parent who has according to one comment I saw on a blog just lost a child but I also am a person who sees a problem with the way that people just hop on these bikes and act as if they own the entire road and it doesn't matter to them if there is a precious package on the back of it or if the car that they decide to suddenly flip in front of is full of children. Education needs to be a priority why would anyone oppose education and some added safety for the passenger. Read the law again and think that if one life can be saved it is worth it. I miss my daughter so much and that alone is the reason that I don't want another Mom to have to go thru this. No I'm not ignorant enough to think that this will solve all of the problems and save everyone from the horrible death that my daughter had. At 19 years of age she had touched so many lives and I plan on this law being positive and helpful to to
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"The citizens of Texas. With or without your support we will continue to work toward the goal of education. God bless you and I hope you never experience the loss of a child in this manner. Melissa Bullock Malorie's mom."
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So, apparently it's big bad bikers fault that her daughter got on the back of a bike. She doesn't seem willing to accept that it was her daughter's decision to get on. Sure, I hate the *******es that act like idiots on public rides and give all motorcyclists a bad name in the media and in society, but we can't legislate against an entire group passed on one small segment of its population.I'm all for education and making sure that riders are competent and skilled before putting a passenger on the bike. ****, I love that the MSF is required for an M-class license now, and I'd loveto see mandatory helmet laws (even jacket laws!) but I know legislation isn't going to change anything. We need to raise public awareness and increase rider education.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Read the law again and think that if one life can be saved it is worth it.
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I dislike when people say this. If you expended hundreds of thousands of dollars or more and thousands of man hours on this legislation it's not worth it if it only saves one life. Folks like this think that whay they are doing and promoting is always worth it or a worthy cause if it "saves even one life". No it's not. How many lives could that money save if it went into medical research? If you added all the man hours together to get something like this though and enforce it does it equal to one persons average time spent on the Earth?
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

If you really want to legislate more there are better ways of saving more motorcycle deaths. Not advocating any of them but just sayin' this would save way more lives than the niche 'sportbike' legislation.

1. Compulsory intensive testing (including pratical on correct cornering technique and correct braking)
2. Compulsory helmet laws
3. Staggered power or cc or power/weight requirements (0-2yrs experience 60hp limit etc.)

Fix #1 on the list and I bet none of the others are necessary.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

What a poorly drafted piece of legislation. Confusing and misleading, but also discriminatory against a particular class. This goes well beyond "education" as noted by the sponsors and into personal choice.

However, it is always the 5% that ruin it for the rest of us.

From above: "You mention bad apples does that include the idiots that I have seen on sport bikes weaving in and out of traffic and driving at high rates of speed without concern for others around them."

The problem being one of public perception and media coverage. I have read dozens of recent articles in major metro areas about stunters holding up traffic to wheelie and also running from the cops. There will be no public empathy or common sense from the legislators for the rest of us when moms, grandmas, and law enforcement start complaining about "sportbikes" gone wild.

At least the cruiser crowd had Sputnik to take the lead on personal choice / helmet issues. I am guessing that the bulk of the younger sportbike crowd primarily impacted have no idea.

This is a slippery slope for ALL motorcycles. Be careful.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

"This is a slippery slope for ALL motorcycles. Be careful."
No doubt.

I remember the same type legislature on guns singling assault rifles... then "the list" showed up afterward. And the cap on rounds.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

More correspondence from the sister. She toned it down a little, so I did, too:

Natalie Bullock said:
Sir I'm sorry you feel the way you do about this law. My family and I are just trying to save one life. One person not to go thru what we have. The boy that had the bike had it less than 4 months and he was reckless and killed my sister. She was in the honors college to be a physical therapist. She had everything goinh for her until that night. This law is to help educate those young teens who want to ride. We are not trying to get rid of bikes. Do you have a daughter? You have no clue what its like to get that phone call. That your baby sister won't be home anymore.? I knew we would run into people like you during this process and that's ok. But don't place it for my family to see!!
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Tim Kreitz said:
Well, at least I've gone from "***hole" to "sir". That's an improvement.

We've all experienced pain and death in our families, Natalie. That's not an excuse to tread on the rights of others just because our intentions are good. I promise you that your law will not save a single life, it'll just make things more difficult for law-abiding riders and discriminate against anyone who owns a sportbike. It'll also cause ever more non-legit riders with passengers to run from the cops, getting more people killed. Is what your sister would want?

An acquaintance of mine summed it up perfectly:

"Using [these people's] logic we need to create a separate law for every single bike style, brand, color, you name it, everytime someone has a fatal accident. It's basically the same logic as requiring a special condition to drive a Ford F-150 because someone ran a light and hit a pedestrian once."

He's right. You're wrongly singling out an age group and bike type simply because they represent the manner in which your family member died. You're attempting to replace her lack of personal responsibility with a bad law. She was a grown woman who made a poor decision and paid the ultimate price. No posited law can change that, nor prevent it from happening again in the future.

It may interest you to know that all riders in Texas are required to take and pass a motorcycle safety course which includes a classroom module on how to properly carry a passenger. I wonder if the politician you have in your back pocket is aware of that, because I'll be honest, none of you leading this movement appear to know the first thing about motorcycling.

I'm contacting my senator today in opposition to this law. I'm also sending emails to motorcycle associations across Texas in an effort to spread awareness and resistance. I urge you once again to instead focus your efforts on encouraging voluntary motorcycle safety and public awareness, rather than on passing coercive laws. If you truly want to make motorcycling safer, that's the only moral choice you have.
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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

:popcorn:
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

And how will an LEO be able to tell how long you've had an M endorsement? That information is not contained on the license now. I kinda think it would be cool if it did, mine would show (working math furiously) 33 years (eeek - I'm that old ?!?!?).

Is any bike lightweight if my fat tushie is on it?

So how does the passenger having a license make the rider not be stupid?

Just on these two items alone this law is pathetic.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

http://www.fyi.legis.state.tx.us/

Tell your state senator this is a bad discriminatory law, with severe structural and procedural flaws that will make it impossible to actually implement.
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Simmons1 said:
:popcorn:
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+1

My original thought was "well, if they created that law for all motorcycles I might support it"...........and then I read the "she was a grown woman who made a bad choice and paid the ultimate price".

Maybe the MC license should list how long you've had it. Kinda like a credit card. "Member since 1984". Then before you jump on the back of a superbike with an 18 year old rider, you can look at his license and make an informed decision about whether you want a ride or not. :doh:

Not that it would affect me. I'm not riding on the back of anyone's bike unless I have absolutely no choice. :lol2:
 
Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

Sent to my senator this morning:

Dear Senator Seliger:

Please vote against HB 2470, the discriminatory bill known as "Malorie's Law", which recently passed the Texas House.

HB 2470 attempts to discriminate against a specific type of motorcycle genre ("sportbike") in reaction to the death of a young woman who was unfortunately killed in a crash while riding pillion on one.

The bill would prohibit riders of sportbikes (a term which is effectively impossible to accurately define legally) who have been licensed for less than two years to carry a passenger. This law would not apply to the riders of so-called "cruiser", "touring", "standard" or "enduro" motorcycles, and is therefore highly discriminatory.

Furthermore, all licensed riders in Texas are already required to complete and pass a safety course which includes a classroom module on carrying passengers. In its discrimination, "Mallory's Law" would also be somewhat redundant.

Bad facts lead to bad laws, and emotional legislation instigated by grieving parents is often to blame. Please oppose HB 2470.

Sincerely,

Tim Kreitz
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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

My email to Steve Ogden

Simply, this is bad, discriminatory law.

First, it is highly subjective in its definition of "Sport bike". What if I sit up, then it's not a sport bike?

Second, how will an LEO be able to tell how long the operator has had an M endorsement? That information is not contained on the license now. So how expensive will it be to implement this law?

Third, how does the passenger having a license make the rider not be stupid? They can't override the rider and keep the motorcycle from crashing in an emergency.

While I can understand the pain of a grieving parent, this is bad discriminatory law, with severe structural and procedural flaws that will make it impossible to actually implement and enforce.

I could perhaps support it if the change was for all motorcyclists, but to call out a particular class of motorcycle based on subjective criteria is wrong.

Honestly, it's also redundant, there are plenty of laws on the books that require motorcycle operators to act responsibly. One more law won't change anything, nor bring back daughters.

Thank you,

Daryl
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Re: HB 2470 - Heads up sportbikes, they're gunning for you...

I've had a license for over 10 years and occasionally carried passengers from the very beginning. I was pretty squidly at first and pulled wheelies with a passenger on the back (not to mention speeding). I was dumb and very lucky nothing bad ever happened. It was also illegal, though. Making it illegal for me to simply carry a passenger wouldn't have stopped me from doing it any more than it stopped me from popping a wheelie or speeding. Misguided legislation.
 
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